This is the Simply Home Podcast - Ladies Who Build, a podcast for women by women.

This is Ashley Wainscott and Michelle Mullins.

After spending the last 10 years revolutionizing the construction industry and raising the bar of the contracting world.

We are inviting you on our journey as we continuously learn how to be extraordinary and thrive in this industry.

Now, come hang with us.

Welcome to episode 22 of the Ladies Who Build podcast. Today, we are talking about the very fun world of construction material with a very special guest. Some of the summary of key points we'll be hitting is the importance of planning ahead of time with your project material. We're going to be talking about specific processes and requirements for material or our specific process and requirements. What the difference is with the material that clients provide versus what we provide and what makes a successful project in regards to material. So without further ado, I'd like to welcome our very special guest.

Joey! Whoop whoop.

Yay, Joey.

Well, thank you both for having me. I've watched everyone else's podcast. So I've been waiting for mine. Yeah, so.

Waiting for your moment to shine?

Yeah.

So now that you're going to head into stardom, will you give us some background of like how you got here, your history with construction. I know it kind of ties in with family and.

Yeah.

It goes way back but tell everyone about it Joey.

So, my construction background started when I was born. I was born into a just full construction family. So my great-grandfather started a company called AGI down in Southern California. And it's now one of the largest commercial general contracting companies in the United States. And so my grandfather, he worked there for a little while and then he broke off down to San Antonio. And so he started a home building company. And then all his sons and some of his daughters worked for him. My dad was one of them. And so I kind of grew up in the construction industry in that way.

I was on and off job sites all the time. Growing up, I, you know, I would be helping with remodels, new builds, whatever they were doing, you know? I wasn't anything special. I was just more of a handyman with the last name of the owner.

Then when I started, I guess my career, I went to school for was irrigation. Specifically on for the sustainable irrigation, how to be, at that time, we lived in Prescott, Arizona, which is high desert. And so trying to figure out how to reduce water usage while also putting it out there for plants. And so I worked on commercial and residential jobs during that and project managing jobs.

And I later moved up into a just landscape construction project manager. And so decks, pergolas, driveways, anything related to that. And then, we decided to move down to South Texas to be closer to family. We went through San Antonio and that wasn't our vibe. And so me and Mia felt that Austin was the best place. And that's where there's Simply Home.

And here you are.

Look at us now.

Amazing! So basically construction’s in your blood.

It is.

You were bred pork.

It wasn't really another option I was going through.

Yeah, right, right.

You said bread and I got hungry.

Let's talk about the bread.

It's your bread and butter.

Yeah.

It is. Yeah. It’s my bread and butter.

So the materials role to, I was gonna, this just popped into my head, but I know this was a different role from something's been in before. So this was a new challenge for you coming into Simply Home.

Yeah, it was, my previous roles really incorporated the materials coordinator role in there, you know, I was already responsible for material as a project manager. And so, this was the first time I had worked for a company where that role was just one single person that wasn't the project managers. You know, responsibility. And so it's been a lot of learning. I know I was in construction, but now being full-time in residential construction, there's been a lot of growing and learning. It's been great working with you guys.

What do you think of the difference of the role? Like how it's separated with us versus it being incorporated in other roles.

I think. Well, I think it adds, it brings in a lot of attention to detail that sometimes it was overlooked before. When you were focused on everything is a project manager before and you know, and both of you guys know with project management, there's a lot that goes into it. You're dealing with clients here. You're dealing with vendors, you're dealing with all of that. And then on top of that two, you’re also coordinating material. Things get forgotten and things get overlooked, problems start to arise. And so there's a lot more, just attention to detail that's happening now that I see that previous roles weren't there. So yeah.

Yeah. Very smart.

Yeah.

Smarter with Joey too.

We are. Yes, because you're right. I think about, when you are saying how everything is usually lumped in with other roles, that was one of the main goals of like, when we separated all of these roles, it is so specific because it really can be a full, as you know, it's a full-time job with it, with what you're doing, whether it's like vendor management or materials, our client management, whatever it is like financial. There's so much that can be done to make it a full-time role.

So then to think someone's just doing all of that. I met, I still, to this day, I still meet people that are like, yeah, I do all of that. I wear all the hats. I'm like, oh, why? You don't have to do that anymore.

Yeah, there was a company I saw not long ago where it was a wife and husband and they do everything. And they, they've managed multiple jobs at once. And I'm thinking, man, I can't imagine you guys have much time for anything else.

Right. They don't have a life.

It's a lot. There's a lot of different roles and hats in construction. You don't want to wear them all.

No.

Yeah.

We've worn them all and it's not.

And I want to take them off.

It’s not a really cute look.

It’s not.

It's not cute. You have a cowboy hat and a fedora. And then the baseball hat and it's just through.

It's a lot. That's it.

And there's no way it looks good on anyone.

No.

Like, I don't even think.

Even if they think they can do it well, they can't.

No.

Sorry.

Even if you think it's going well, but it's actually not.

It’s not. Yeah, for sure. Okay so specifically in your role with Simply Home, what have you seen has been one of the more harder materials for clients to select when they're going through the process or like maybe what do they don't understand that you would walk them through?

I think tile. Tile's a big one because there's, there's other little aspects that you got to think about. Grout, trim, all of those things. And then there's the whole aspect of design that a lot of times gets thrown into it and clients, they want to know how certain colors work together, how things are going to fit together. The quantities needed to buy. The overage that's needed to purchase it. And so I think a lot of times there's a lot of question marks with that.

Tile, trim, grout. Those are all things that almost all the time, the clients leave left out when you ask them to fill things out, because there maybe just isn't that knowledge that's there. So that's definitely something that I think I see clients struggle with a lot. It’s because tile is, it's so small compared to the grand scheme of the project.

So a lot of times your eyes immediately focused on cabinets and all these other things that you spend a lot of attention and time planning for, and you never planned for the smaller things like title, trim and grout.

Oh, my gosh. And even like sanded or unsanded grout, it was so difficult for me to wrap my head around when I first was getting into this. I always go back to the chart and the bag. Wait, wait, wait. What are the grouts?What are the grout lines that need sanded versus unsanded and like, we learned the hard way about marble using sanded grout. Right? And how it can scratch the marble.

Learned the hard way. Yeah. PTSD with grout.

I know. There's so much to learn and that's where you work with experts.

Yeah.

Like us and Joey where you've already been through these situations and you can properly educate. And we were just talking about a client that you recently had to talk through. Like mitering versus all of the other options that you wouldn't know that you have to make that decision.

Yeah, I mean, that if, if you're going to go with mitered, it's going to be more of a square, you know? If you want to do a pencil on the edge, it's going to be more of a round. You know, these are little tiny things that go into not only design, but also just into trim options that a lot of times, clients don't.

They don't fully plan for it. Think through all the way. They just think of the big things. And so that's not a fault on anybody else's, but it's just that, something that I see a lot of clients struggle with.

Yeah.

And Joey also, you've mentioned that client that has the depths, the different depths of tile and.

Oh, yeah.

There's like one that's larger in the shower and then they have a larger Schluter. You said?

Yeah. And it ends up looking like a little staircase, you know? And it's not going to look good. And you know, that's part of my job is catching those little things and saying, Hey, you have a, you know, a three eights off over here, and you're going to notice that, or you're going to feel that difference. And so it's pointing those things out, making sure that they understand all of those things. That's a lot of my role.

A lot of detail.

Yeah.

Let's talk about, oh, the timeline. How long clients should really give themselves, like if you're thinking about.

A month minimum.

Okay.

In my opinion. When working with the designer or when going over your material selections, a month is and no matter what you do, I think minimum. If you're doing a full home plan, like two months. You know, planning longer because there are, I mean, it's going to take you two or three weeks just to get all your cabinet details.

It's going to take you one to two weeks to get all your countertop details, you know, and if you try to rush it, you are going to make choices that you are not happy with. And that, you know, you're not going to fix for another 10, 15 years. So, you know, take your time. So like the choices, because rushing a design process, rushing a material selection process is going to really give you some bad choices.

Well, and I think if you're, that's a good timeline, if people are decisive, but if you're not decisive and you really don't know what you are at, I'm like six months to a year. Maybe you need to think about that. I mean, and people do. I mean, people come to us and they’re like I've been planning for a year. I've been planning for more than that. And so, but it really is like, you need to know what you want, because then you're just paying for people to redo all of your ideas. Like you're paying for your designer to redraw things. It's like, no, no, just know what you want going into it.

It's great when you have those clients who come and they have all the, they come with a designer and they have everything selected because they've taken the last five, six months working with the designer. But then you get those other ones who come and they only want to plan for a month and they have a full home. Not going to be possible. You know.

Two different people in this world for sure.

There is.

And we see them on the materials side.

Yeah.

Yeah I mean even a month, cause even a month planning a recent bathroom project, you know, that was intense and that was with someone that was very decisive. And that knew what they wanted. And time's, time's important.

Right.

A month is.

Like, I don't even know if I could do it in a month for my own bathroom. You know what I mean? That's just a lot. That’s a lot.

I can’t do anything. I can do a lot of things for clients but anything for myself.

Yeah.

Forget that, and if I make rash decisions, like what you were saying earlier, then it's just it's, I'm going to regret not thinking through it and not giving myself space. And I've done it so many times where I'm like, you know, I just really thought about how I was going to utilize this or utilize this space. I would have realized this and now I don't use it as well as I could have.

Yeah.

You know,

You mentioned something earlier about how long it takes for cabinet designs to be played out for people? I think, I mean, I think we could literally talk about the cabinets as a whole podcast on its own.

Yeah.

But high level water, I mean, obviously it's all necessary for building, but like, what do you see as the biggest maybe hang up or the biggest, like time stock for cabinets?

The renderings. That always takes a long time because we start off with you meeting with me, meeting with the designer. We're going to get all your preliminary options. That's basically just to help me know who to select as our cabinet vendor. You know, if you tell me you want more of a modern look and it's a full custom kitchen, I'm not going to go with the guy who does smaller vanities for us, you know, so that all those options help me out.

And then we're going to meet with them with the cabinet vendor. And we're going to go over all those details. And they're going to start renderings, which can take a week to two weeks. But I've seen a lot of times where those renderings take a big part of the, part of the planning time, because there's going to be two to three different things that you're going to see in those 3d renderings and are going to say, I don't like that, or I want to change that, or I want to tweak that a little bit in it. You know, those, those, the designers, they have a full schedule.

And so it can sometimes take a week or so before we get updated renderings, and then you want to update that rendering. And so that always seems to take a big part of the process and for a full custom kitchen cabinetry line, you can, you can be looking at anywhere from a month to a month and a half of just planning in that alone. And it takes some time. So.

Yeah.

It's definitely an area where you need patience and spend some time aside for that.

Joey talk to us about what decisions usually clients have to make with cabinets.

Well, ultimately everything. You got to really, I mean, down to the hinges you want, the drawers you want, how many drawers you want, the door style, the door, soft close, hard close. Typically we like do soft close and everything, but just, those are all details that are included. Total kicks. There's just so many details that go into cabinets that take a lot of time that there’s a lot of details. Yeah.

There are. And they all take you thinking through the functionality of it.

And a lot of times, you know, I mean when I was first introduced to cabinets, I didn't know a whole lot about it. And so, you know, a lot of these clients, they just, they, they see the Pinterest photo and say, I want that cabinet without realizing everything that goes behind the cabinets, the guts of it all. And so, you know, that's why it's always great we meet with a representative from these companies and they walk you through the whole process, but there's a lot of decisions that need to be made.

I think functionality is like a really big one with cabinets too, because you have to like, to your point, let's say you get initial renderings, I would even sit on those renderings for a little bit and actually play with okay, if the trash is here and my pantry is here because then you don't want your trash too far from your sink. And then what do you need that’s on your oven side? And so I think there's so many things that you don't even think it looks very different on paper than it does in the physical world.

And so I think that's a really good thing when people are going through a whole new custom cabinetry design and layout. It’s just like, sleep on that and read on it and then consider, okay, do I need to make any tweaks? Cause that's the, that's the time to do it.

Yeah.

You know.

There's so many details with it, you know, I mean, we've had jobs where you know, you want everything you, you think about and then when it comes time to templating, we realized that if he pulled two doors out at the same time, you only have two, three inches. I mean, these are all details that have to be thought out. And so there was a lot and that's part of the time and process.

And I even think about every kitchen has a weird, funky thing that you have to account. Like a weird corner cabinet or where two drawers are going to hit each other. And you have to think of how to utilize the space best.

Yeah.

I know, I curse the person that put that upper cabinet to the left of my sink, because who can reach that?

Yeah.

And how functional is that?

Yes.

They were like, that's not for her.

That's really close to my height.

Really?

You got to stand to account for it.

I’m 5’4.

Oh, yeah.

Yeah.

Yeah. I got to crawl up in there. And if I had longer arms, this would be way more convenient, but it's things like that that I’m like who advise them to put that there. I mean, pull out drawers, especially when you have weird cabinets and things, having experts to advise on these weird situations would be helpful.

Yeah.

Yeah. We've all seen those funny videos where you got to pull the store, pull that out. Get to that. Yeah, that's you know, those are things that we talk about and go through.

Yeah.

Yeah.

We're here to avoid.

And where cabinet doors, when they open, we had a strange project way back in the day that something like that happened.

Well, the biggest one is like that little corner drawer where you put out and the door handle runs into the oven handle. And so then it gets stuck.

Oh, yes.

Yeah.

But it's like, pushed in this little corner and so you think it'd be fine. But you have to like open the oven in order to open the door.

Yes.

Oh, my gosh. We've seen so many of those.

We totally have. And I think there was one where like a cabinet hardware is something like it could barely slide past a door. It was something so weird where their new cabinet hardware was the reason that it couldn't. Yeah.

Yeah.

Thinking through things, man.

So many things.

It goes a long way.

Yeah.

Okay. So I also wanted to talk about the material check-in process. I don't, I think this process is really unique to us because.

Yeah.

I think we're really great. But talk to us about that process towards the end of the sales process, but right before construction starts.

Yeah, so the material process, I always tell clients as we have it for two main reasons and that's to stay organized and to eliminate anxiety. It's a process that's been calculated over a lot of different jobs and based off of that, we're saying we have a month and a half to play in your job. How can we properly organize this time to where all of these materials selections, which can seem overwhelming at first, can be made to stay on track. But also can be made without being overwhelmed as a client.

And so those are the things that I think about and we think about at Simply Home and we try to really think from the client perspective, you know. If you have a full home, what are the, what are the timelines of the check-ins that's going to work best for you? Typically, we like to do two or three. There's check-ins there for me to first see where you are emotionally, you know. Is this feeling overwhelming for you? Is there anything I can help you with?

And once we kind of get past that point, then we're there to really check the materials that are being selected and make sure that these are going to be conducive to your CAD plans. I always give the example if we have a room that's eight by ten and you select a fan that's a, has six to eight feet in diameter, that's not going to work.

So these are the things that we go through. We check and look at before we may call those final selections. So I feel like the process has really been honed down to where it eliminates a lot of stress from the clients while still getting those selections made.

That’s a great example of a fan. I’ve never thought about that.

I've never thought about that too and I was like, huh, good point. Fascinating.

That didn't come up for us.

I know. I was surprised.

And then, so you check, your checking with the client throughout the process and then you have a big, big check-in. We actually physically checking in materials.

Right at the end.

Right at the end.

And that typically happens in steering our project management meeting. And that's where I check in all your material. I go through everything. I open every box. And that's to help you and help us, you know? We don't want defective material. Times like that we realize, oh, we're short of box. We're short two boxes of this. Because those are surprises we don't like when, come construction.

So there's always surprises every time you, you start a job, but the surprises we can help is, you know, materials and we try to do our best to make sure everything's there or make sure none of the materials are defective. And that's where our final check-in happens. So that's why we like to have all those dates set up so that by the time that meeting comes, I can go through everything and properly check in all your material.

Yeah. Because we have had that happen with.

Yeah.

Things.

But there's almost with every job, there's almost one little thing that needs to be adjusted almost every time, you know? Things get misplaced. Things did not come with the company that we're supposed to. You know? There was just a job where we were short three boxes from a flooring company and they delivered it, you know? So it's like, you know, these are little things that we check in so that by the time construction starts, we're not short three boxes.

Yes. It's even less blame game because it has been sitting there for two to three months and they're like, well, I don't, I mean, I dropped off two, three months ago. How do you, how do I know?

Yeah.

You didn't lose it.

Yeah. I think that is one of the biggest things, one of the many things that makes Simply Home unique with materials is that we require all of the materials to be purchased and checked in before construction starts and not everybody requires that. And I know just from my experience, clients have had some pushback towards that in the past. Like why do I need to give you a toilet when we're not installing the toilet for another eight weeks, right?

Yeah.

So I think it's really important for you, maybe just to kind of touch on like, why that's so important and then like, what are the repercussions if we didn't do it that way.

Yeah. So the reason, first and foremost, is time. Time is everything and if we can save confusion, we can save all of those things that come up. So let's take the toilet, for example. We, as the materials coordinator, I can see the toilet. If the toilet is damaged in any way, we return it and we can save that part of the process. We also can. I'm also going to be making sure that that specific toilet's going to work just because the specs look like it will work. Once I actually see it in person, then it's like, okay, yes, this will actually work for the things, you know?

There's so many times where we've taken valves or things and we go to screw on it and they don't work. They don't, they're not compatible. And so, realizing and picking those things up early on in the process, saves time. Even with some products, there are lead times that a lot of clients don't realize.

Let's take an appliance for instance. We would want that appliance much sooner, because if there is any sort of a defect or if there's anything wrong with that appliance, because appliances can have anywhere from a six to eight week lead time, sometimes even longer, depending on. I've seen appliances have up to an eight month lead time.

So that's eight months, you might be without a stove. Eight months, you might be without a certain item. And that can hold up the whole construction process that can hold up from finishing our part of the job. If there's, if there's plumbing materials that aren't there on time, again, that can hold up the job. And so these were all things that we tried to do beforehand, so that there's no delays from a material standpoint on the construction process.

Yeah, I can't even tell you how many times when we didn't require that. How many times we run into like just delays, constant delays. And then the same thing with pulling this material actually doesn't fit and it is on, I mean, to the client's credit is on us to make sure that it does fit because they don't know. They don't know what they're ordering.

They require us to tell them this works or doesn't work. And so when that time comes and it doesn't work, that's on us, that we should have checked out ahead of time. And so, I'm so glad that we have this process now, but yeah, and we just like, once we get going, we keep going. And so then we can schedule one of the guys to get in there and we can say, okay, the materials in the garage and it's in this specific area, like go.

You know, instead of us having to like keep coming back. So, I mean, there's literally countless reasons why I think this is a good idea that we require this, but yeah. It's huge.

Yeah. I mean, I've even seen things like going back to the lead time tight, you know? There are, I've seen it time and time again, where you know, you give a tile a month and there's a good chance that, that my tile might be out of stock, might be they, they no longer sell that tile. And now we have finished a whole bathroom and we're short a box and they don't sell that tile anymore. Things like that come up, they happen. They're rare, but they happen. And so we are here to try to prevent those rarities and keep those away as much as possible.

Yeah and I think back to the days in which we didn't have someone solely dedicated to this, and it was a struggle for us to keep, to keep all the details together and for us to keep, to keep it all organized and to think through, okay, great, when is that arriving? When can I schedule the plumber? Okay. When is that arriving? When can I schedule the electrician? And now we realize, our schedule doesn't have to be based on materials. It can be based on the best flow of a project. Because we maximize our time by getting into the project, doing it well and getting out.

Yeah.

And the soonest and most efficient way possible. And the same thing works in the benefit of the client, the, as soon as we get out of their home, the more that they'll like us. And so it's just, it's a pro on both ends and materials are honestly the yellow brick road that leads you to like, you know, it leads you to a smoother construction process, but all other variables aside, at least we're starting the project knowing, okay, we have everything we need.

Yeah.

It feels good.

I know. It does feel good, for sure. Okay. So for a client, explain the types of material that they don't have to provide, or that Simply Home provides.

Anything, in my opinion, that's not decorative, hardwood or lumber, drywall, PVC pipes, things that, that, you know, electrical wire. None of those things are for the clients to purchase. What would be on a client to purchase would be light fixtures, plumbing fixtures, tile, flooring. Those are items that are all decorative. Again, the main four things that we Simply Home purchase, but you still need to be a part of the design process is going to be countertops, cabinets, windows, and doors. We need you to help us. Know what you want, but ultimately those are the things that we will be purchasing, but anything, like I said, anything decorative. So tiles, pictures, all of those things, mantels. Those are the things that customers purchase.

Yeah. So clients don't have to worry about buying two by fours and nails and all that stuff.

Yeah.

That'd be so funny.

That would be a disaster.

It really would be. I mean, grout was tough enough. And now we just buy it.

Now we buy the grout.

But grout was the one thing that we were like, okay, maybe they can handle this cause it's.

Right.

Their color.

Yeah.

I always loved, back in my old job, you'd get clients who would reach out and say, hey, we want you guys to come do work. We already bought all the material. We just need you to do it right.

Oh yeah. I heard that.

I would say, okay, let's go look. They don't have half the material you need, you know?

Yes.

There's a lot of time, so, so much more that goes into it. And so a lot of times, you know, even the decorative can feel stressful to a client. So I can't imagine that they have to buy.

Yeah.

The lumber packages and they have to buy the wire packages and all that.

Oh my gosh, that'd be insane.

Yeah.

Yeah. That would be laughable what they'd end up with. Because you know?

Yeah.

We’ll send them to Home Depot with the list and see what they come back with.

So there is good news. It was that you don't have to provide every single construction material, but you just provide, like the pretty stuff that you could have fun picking out.

And we also, tell Joey, provide shower glass.

Yeah.

But Joey doesn’t specifically order it. But we do provide it.

Yeah.

Because we have to measure for it, then we have to custom order it. It comes later. It's not something you pre-order.

Yeah.

Also, talk to us about the materials sheet.

That is, that's my bread and butter.

Yeah.

Okay.

That's the thing that, we, I feel like both on the sales side and the project management side, we all refer off of. The material sheet is basically a document that the clients have to fill out. We have, I go through your scope and I put everything that you need to purchase.

And what you're going to do is you're going to put the link. And there, and then you've got to put your dates that you bought it and all of that. And it's, it's a document, it's a living document that the client can refer back to, I can refer to, everybody can refer to. To know what materials they're purchasing. But it also in a lot of ways covers the clients.

So if they are purchasing a certain item and I approve it, and later it doesn't work, then you know, we know who were the problems at. And also if the client's about to buy something, then I can go in there and look at a link and say, that's not going to work, then we can fix it from there. So and then also switching over to the project management side of things. I know that they utilize that material sheet often when they're looking at maybe the tiles that are going to be involved or the plumbing fixtures that will be involved when they're sending those to the vendors that are going to be installing them. So all the way around, it's a very useful sheet.

Okay. Is there anything like last remaining thoughts around material that you would want clients to know or you wish they knew going into a project?

I would say, like I said earlier, the biggest thing is to be patient. There's a lot of decisions that are going to be made. And so really take your time. If your start date needs to be pushed a little bit, you'd rather your start date be pushed a month and have things installed that you’ll later regret. So just really take your time when picking your materials, selecting them and you know, we're here to help.

So I do my best to take your selections and make them work. If they're not going to work, then I'll let you know, but we do our best to make them work for you so that you can get the remodel you desire.

Yeah. Yeah, that's a really good one. Patience. Patience as a virtue.

Yes, it is.

Okay. Should we jump into fun questions?

Yeah.

What's the best kept secret of Austin, Texas?

Best kept secret. Well, I've only been here for five months, so I don't have a whole lot of Austin experience. There's a lot of cool high school tracks that you can go to that are always free. And you know, that's something me and Mia go to. We go to the tracks and go run and walk. And there's a lot of nice high schools here. So.

Nice. Okay. What is a hidden talent of yours?

I guess. Yeah, I guess it's a talent, but I am an old soul in the way that I can talk to old people really well. So I'm very good with old people. Older clients. That was always my specialty and somehow we can always have a great relationship. I've never met an old person I wasn't able to RESA, you know?

You do have an old soul.

Yeah.

For sure.

You for sure do.

Yeah.

Are you like a hidden 80 year old man?

It's kinda, I think so. Yeah.

Okay. Next question, out of all office supplies, what would be your favorite item?

Okay, so this was one I did not know I liked until I came to Simply Home. So that additional monitor.

Hm.

I, when I first got it, I was like, I'm not using that, you know? I got my laptop and those pioneers my laptop. And then finally one day, I plugged it in and I was like, this is amazing. I just did it, that the whole screen was a big screen and it just, you know, you don't have to like, bend over or nothing. You just sit back and work. So that's probably my favorite one.

Someone else said that too. The monitor.

Really?

Yeah. I don't know who it was, but.

I love my monitor.

I’m trying to think who it was.

Okay. What is something positive in the media world you've seen lately?

Well, we were talking about this earlier, but a couple of weeks ago, I saw on social media, still media. A trend where you go in and out and you get the flying Dutchman which is two patties. It's got cheese in the middle and then it's wrapped in a whole grilled onion.

What?

Yeah. It's interesting.

I just keep reacting.

You got to hear me out on it, okay?

Okay.

I was like, you don't miss the buns, Joey?

No. The buns take away from the flavor.

Okay.

But you eat it like that. You get some sauce. Some in and out sauce and you just put it on top and you eat it like that. And it's the best thing that I've had in awhile. I probably, since I've seen it, probably had like 10, 15 of them.

Oh my gosh. Stop.

Yeah.

You ate them since last week?

Two weeks ago.

Oh.

Yeah.

You’ve had 15 of them.

I don't know if it's been 15, but it's pretty close. It’s getting there.

Okay, Joey, thank you so much for being on the pod.

Yeah.

We really loved learning from you. I think there's so much that I feel like, we do like kind of tap the surface of materials but truly, what we got out of this is that your role is vital to the success of a project.

I hope, I hope.

Yeah.

Okay. Thank you for sharing everything with us.

Thank you for having me.